Why more than 2 scale shapes?

[Han]

Just watched Steve’s lesson on jazz arpeggios. It didn’t answer a question I’ve had for years now: I still find it difficult to understand why one would want to play arpeggios all over the neck. In each position, with root on string 6, you can cover two octaves. Maybe add another set of arpeggios working from the fifth string. This means only two scale shapes to learn. No need for anything more. Or am I missing something?

[Wim VD1]

On 10/19/2020 at 10:01 PM, Han said:

Just watched Steve’s lesson on jazz arpeggios. It didn’t answer a question I’ve had for years now: I still find it difficult to understand why one would want to play arpeggios all over the neck. In each position, with root on string 6, you can cover two octaves. Maybe add another set of arpeggios working from the fifth string. This means only two scale shapes to learn. No need for anything more. Or am I missing something?

The advantage of knowing the five (CAGED) shapes for each arpeggio is that you can stay in roughly the same position on the neck when playing over a chord progression.

And it gives you more flexibility as for one and the same chord or arpeggio, playing at a different position on the neck will give you a different voicing.

I agree it is a big task to memorize them all, so you need to decide if you want to put in the necessary work.

Wim.

[Han]

Thanks Wim!

 

[Triple-o]

On 10/19/2020 at 2:01 PM, Han said:

Just watched Steve’s lesson on jazz arpeggios. It didn’t answer a question I’ve had for years now: I still find it difficult to understand why one would want to play arpeggios all over the neck. In each position, with root on string 6, you can cover two octaves. Maybe add another set of arpeggios working from the fifth string. This means only two scale shapes to learn. No need for anything more. Or am I missing something?

I am currently reading a book on arpeggios by Stephan Ross.In the book he says  "the ability to move around the neck fluently through all of the arpeggios forms provides greater creative freedom and leads to more interesting lines".

It also said to use what you know, so he wouldn't  be concerned about  you using two scale shapes.  In the book he is using the 5 pentatonic patterns. It is a beginner book, so I assume he is trying to keep it simple and not over whelming. One of my books listed about 35 shapes and the caged system as must know. It doesn't even mention arpeggios and the first time I saw it I was a little depressed. Now' I see all the over-laps of those shapes and its not as daunting as it first appeared.

Seems like I remember other teachers talking about how they use E and A shape barre chords to help them get oriented moving around the neck to find chord tones. Then there’s all the triad shapes on the neck hiding in plain sight.

I haven't had the time to play much with the caged system, but from what I've seen,  it’s also a good away to  provide a viable method of playing arpeggios and moving around the neck. I like the way it lays out. Again, without spending much time with it  I am assuming that in addition to the  5 main patterns, there are the  other  like maj7 ,dim 7, min7,dom7.

I have also seen many teachers using the same method Steve was talking about. Hal Leonard's theory book shows that method along with a few other books.Steve  said it sounds and looks more complicated than it really is and I am sure he knows. 

I  think that if one started with a major or minor scale shape or mode shape (dorian or mixolydian)  and fingered only the chord tones you would eventually end up with all the shapes he was showing. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6IpgFOPc1E

https://www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusic/mtd.asp?ppn=MN0178770

 

Edited December 3, 2020 by Triple-o